Sophie Zucker was the youngest writer on staff at The Daily Show when she started in 2023, only to find herself and all of her colleagues out of work this summer due to the ongoing Writers Guild strike. Zucker got her comedy start in New York’s Brooklyn scene, forming a sketch collective called Ladies Who Ranch. She picked up her first gig onscreen in The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel, and followed that up with parts in The Other Two and the film Late Night. But she really broke through as both an actress and writer playing Abby on Apple TV’s Dickinson. Zucker spoke with me about her climb up the comedy ladder, how she and her colleagues felt at the beginning of the strike and what she might hope to see at The Daily Show when she returns, as well as her preparations to take her one-woman show, Sophie Sucks Face, to the 2023 Edinburgh Fringe.
Want to discover other cool Substacks? Each morning, The Sample sends you one article from a random blog or newsletter that matches up with your interests. When you get one you like, you can subscribe to the writer with one click. Sign up here.
If you’re not already subscribed to my podcast, please seek it out and subscribe to Last Things First on the podcast platform of your choice! Among them: Apple Podcasts; Spotify; Stitcher; Amazon Music/Audible; iHeartRadio; Player.FM; and my original hosting platform, Libsyn.
This transcript has been edited and condensed only slightly for your convenience.
Last things first: Since when we scheduled this when you were on staff as a writer at The Daily Show at Comedy Central, how are you doing?
Honestly, OK. We knew the strike was coming for a long time. And I agree with all of the demands and I think what we're asking for is some pretty substantial changes to the way that, especially how this streaming industry operates, so I was prepared that it was coming and I was prepared that it was going to take a long time, and I've been picketing and it feels good. We've been, especially in New York, really focused on shutting down productions and that feels like the only cool vigilante thing I'll like ever be a part of as a TV writer, but I'm bored.
The last Writers Guild strike was almost 16 years ago.
Yes. I was in high school.
Did you imagine — when you were in high school during the previous Writers Guild strike — were you at that point imagining a career in screenwriting or acting? Or what was the path that you were envisioning for yourself then?
I loved acting, and I did like musicals and plays and all that stuff. And I did like writing but I didn't really like do it outside of class. But I also knew very early on, or thought I knew that I didn't want to be an actor, because it seemed impossible. Like I was just like, how does anyone? I don't know? I grew up in New York City, so maybe it's just like, New York. You know, I knew what the biz was maybe when I was like a little younger, but it just seemed impossible. So I actually thought I wanted to be a musician for a long time.
According to Google, that's been successful because if you take the Sophie Zucker into Google, the first thing that comes up is Sophie Zucker musical artist. So that's how Google has defined you.
That's cool. I'm OK with that. Yeah, I was a classically trained pianist, and I played for 18 years and then I learned music theory and composing and that kind of stuff and always loved to sing and and took voice lessons and all of that stuff. And then I'd love to write songs, not necessarily funny songs, but sometimes.
Since you grew up in the city, did you go to the magnet performing arts schools?
I didn't. I didn't go to LaGuardia. I went to Hunter, which was a magnet school that had a good performing arts program. Lin-Manuel Miranda went to Hunter and I did a lot of shows there and stuff. But no, there wasn't like a particular focus. I still had to take all those other classes, too.
But your first success in show business wasn't music or writing, it was acting right?
Yeah.
So how did that happen for you when that wasn't in the cards?
Basically, I thought I wanted to do music for a long time. And then I got to college and sort of on a whim, auditioned for an improv team. And I really loved it. And then I started doing sketch and writing for our sort of like offbeat sometimes satirical newspaper, and then instead of going abroad or whatever, which a lot of people do junior year, I just took time off and went to Chicago to do this program at Second City to sort of see if comedy was the thing that I really wanted to do. And I loved being in Chicago, and I loved the program, but I also just loved like going to mics and being in that sort of in-between space where you're just working towards this goal and performing an improv show for like three people in a basement. I just really liked that in a way that I hadn't sort of connected with the gigging in between with like music. So then I came back to New York to go back to Oberlin, graduated and was like, I'm gonna try and do comedy and TV writing. And then I was just like doing what, you know, a lot of people do, working at a day job and performing comedy. And then that's how I got a manager and an agent and they started sending me out for acting roles, because that was sort of what was available to them at the time. And then I got them. So I was like, oh, I am an actor.
So what year did you graduate from Oberlin?
I graduated in 2015.
And then you come straight back to the city?
Yeah
And then when you got representation was that before after you were putting out videos? Were the videos the thing that got you representation?
The thing that got me representation was my live performance. I was hanging out a lot. And I'm like, I'm sure I've made like a couple of videos in there, but I've never been a super super online person. I sort of like do it as as the industry necessitates.
So where did you go as a new college graduate in the city to hang out and get stage time?
I went to the Annoyance New York, which has sort of morphed into Brooklyn Comedy Collective where I still frequent.
That's where I saw the show, right?
Yes, yes, absolutely. So it was really fun to do my show there because that really feels like my sort of home base. I went to Annoyance, it was like a literal basement underneath a jazz club, where I thought the best comedy was happening, and then a few years proved it, you know, all the people that are sort of like succeeding in comedy, I really saw them all perform at Annoyance but then it was also a really intimate community so you could get onstage a fair amount and get booked on shows
Is that where you met the Ladies Who Ranch?
Yes. So Maya (Sharma) I knew actually from Oberlin. So when we graduated, we were captains of feuding improv teams and we were friends. And so we came to New York and hung out. We liked to do this thing where like every Thursday we were just like hanging out at Annoyance for like six hours in a row, watch like every show that ended with the show Holy Fuck. And just like beg for someone to like flirt with us or invite us drinking. We were like 23. And so I’d known Maya before, she was a good friend, but then yeah, the rest of the ladies I met there. And our first show was there too. There was like a 20-minute slot that like kind of just opened up and Maya and I were like, what if we ask those other girls who we think are really funny to do some stuff with us.
How long did it take for the five of you to begin putting on shows and finding venues that would have you do your nonsense?
Not that long. We did it the first time at Annoyance it felt really good. Then Annoyance closed. And my friend Ian Lockwood started running a comedy night at this bar South Fourth Bar that's no longer but it was like around the corner from annoyance where we used all the time anyway. So then we started doing our shows there and then we just sort of like incrementally like started doing them at like slightly larger, more theater-y spaces and we did it at Vital Joint which used to be run by Theresa (Buchheister), who runs The Brick now and then then maybe we were doing at BCC again, and then Union Hall actually reached out to us and was like, Do you want to do the show at Union Hall? We were like we made it! And now we're really busy. We have a show in development and we don't perform as much but we still do a couple of shows here and there.
What's the show in development?
It's an animated show. It’s about the best female hackers in the world called Hackerettes and we've been working on it for a really long time and we were in the middle of pitching it to good responses and then the strike happened. I think some something will happen with it and I hope that it ends up being ultimately very successful and getting made but we'll see.
I suppose the studio could pick it up but they would just do it knowing you wouldn't do any work on it.
Between you and I and whoever's listening to this, whenever they're listening to it. Technically most animated shows are not WGA. They’re IATSE. So there is a world in which this all we can just move forward with it. But IATSE has been really great about not crossing our picket lines. And as a WGA writer myself and our show runner is a WGA writer, you know, we just don't want to undermine the strike. So that's kind of where we're at.
IATSE narrowly avoided a strike just a couple years ago.
Yeah. But I think a lot of them think they they should have struck.
And now SAG is in the middle of authorizing a vote. Are you a SAG member?
I am. At this point. yeah, double union, I sort of bounce back and forth between whatever healthcare is being offered to me the way, depending upon in which capacity I worked a year before.
So what was going on with your comedy career when you started to pick up TV gigs?
TV writing or acting?
The acting came first, right, with things like your stint on Maisel or The Other Two?
So I was like, performing a lot. You know, it's like this thing when you first get into comedy and then all your friends are running shows everywhere and then all of a sudden you have like four shows a week. So I was performing a lot of little shows and I was working a day job where I was answering phones for a start-up, men's razors. That's no longer a start-up, now they're very successful. I didn't have anything to do with that. But they employed me for a year. and then, well, they fired me. I'd been doing some commercial auditions, and I hadn’t booked any of those. But I was getting used to auditioning a lot. And then the very first TV audition I booked was The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel, and it was the first TV audition I ever had. And I got fired because I had to leave to go to the audition. And my work was kind of pissed at me. And I was like, Look, I'm just gonna go to the audition. It won't turn into anything and then I'll be back at work for the rest of the week. And then I've booked and had to be out for an entire day. And then they fired me. But then my manager was like, Oh my God, that's the first one we ever sent you on and they started sending out a bunch more and I booked five in like, six months. Just little one-line stuff. But then they're like, OK, well now you're quickly using up all of the shows in New York. you know, you can't be Law and order again, you can’t be on the other two again. So you we have to start sending out for bigger stuff. And then, shortly after that, I got Dickinson which was like the largest role that I had had at that time.
Dickinson was like a game changer for you, wasn't it because that also got you into the writers room?
Yeah, Dickinson was like first of all, just having a part where they needed me for six months that I was on set for every other episode. At the time I thought I didn't need my day job. Although, in retrospect, I got very lucky that I got asked to be a part of the writers room because I definitely would have had to get a job after that first season came in. And then I got really close with Alena Smith who created the show, just from being on set. I think we have a sort of similar comedic sensibility. I think she sort of writes parts that I love to play. And then she knew that I was writer and she sort of asked to see some of my stuff and then she invited me to be a part of the writers room. And so then I did double duty acting and writing for the rest of the season..
And what was that writers room like? Especially since you were also an actor?
Yeah, I tried really hard to not just jump in for like scenes that were about me are sort of like my adjacent characters. My character is part of this crew of girls. I really loved writing for for Hallie (Steinfeld) for Emily Dickinson. I loved writing for Jane Krakowski for Miss Dickinson. But it was amazing. I mean, I just learned so much about what a writers room is like, you know, we just like sit around and we talk all day and and how to break an episode and backstory and how to write an episode. I also learned a lot about like, this sounds kind of corny but like, really like being an artist with a passion because Alena I think writes from such a place of care and like fire. And it really made me think a lot about the kinds of things that I want to make and put my time into and how to access that inspiration and those feelings, as opposed to not just writing what I could write but writing when I need to write. And that yeah, that was like really invaluable. And then the second season that I did for them was over Zoom. So it wasn't as fun. And then even after the Zoom room ended, I actually like ended up going through a lot of episodes with Alena, with one other writer just sort of reworking them again. The Zoom room is hard. But yeah, it was awesome. It was awesome.
One of the things about that show too is that you know Emily Dickinson wasn't famously known for having a fun life. But the show injects this fun into it in part by pretending like they talk like we talk now.
Now there's so many shows like that like The Great or Bridgerton and she was really ahead on that curve. And I think just looking at, obviously, how, you know, trends. history repeats itself and how things that were happening in the 19th century are also happening now and how that affects the youth. We did a lot of research, which I think you can kind of tell when you watch a show, you know, we were assigned books about culture in the 1800s and Emily Dickinson, certain characters that we were bringing in and so we actually did learn about what kids did for fun in that time and who Emily Dickinson was before she shut herself in her room, which was kind of like an offbeat weirdo poetry girl, which is fun.
I mean today we might say she was working remote.
Today she wouldn't be weird at all. Being a lesbian now, they wouldn’t even bat an eye.
Did you have any other writers room gigs between that and The Daily Show or did you go straight from that?
No, I had like some stuff that was in development and pitching and stuff, but no writing. I did a movie that still hasn't come out yet. No idea when it's gonna come out. Perhaps could be lost to the streaming (purge). And then The Daily Show
And you just joined The Daily Show in January, right?
Yeah.
Which means you joined it was already chaos. Because they didn't have a host. You get hired and it's not like probably anyone else who had gotten hired for The Daily Show. No matter what their age was, because all of the press on you likes to touot that you're the youngest writer for the show.
Only by like a year, but I’ll take it
The more interesting thing to me is that everybody else who was hired was hired for Craig Kilborn or Jon Stewart or Trevor Noah. You're like, who am I writing for? Every week it’s someone different.
I do wonder like, you'll have to ask the showrunners and the head writer like what they were looking for because they didn't know what the voice of the show was gonna be but I remember even going into like my final interview. Everyone was kind of like we don't really know what it's gonna look like but we're excited
and we love your voice.
There was strong point of view in your packet and, well, I'm nothing if not a strong point of view.
So what did they assign you to? Between January and May, where you writing for a specific correspondent or
No. Basically the way that it works is everyone writes for everyone. First and we prepare for the guest host. So like, Leslie Jones was a really great one to start with, because she has such a clear voice. It was really fun to write jokes. It really, really easy to picture jokes that she would say because I can hear her talking in my head. The other ones you'd like watch their special or listen to a podcast that they've done or whatever. We pitch ideas for different correspondents every day for I do like to write for Desi (Lydic), but I also like weirdly got a lot of stuff on Jordan Klepper’s week. The press has been really nice and they've been like wow, it's amazing to watch The Daily Show like shift to these different perspectives every week. But I also think The Daily Show tone is pretty strong and it's more like fitting them in to our tone. So mostly I was just learning how to write late-night.
So my buddy Jason Zinoman at The New York Times put in print that he hoped that the guest hosting would be the new format to make it kind of Saturady Night Live where it's a new host every week. I know that's gotten some pushback. But there's other people who like it. My idea, which I put in my newsletter a few weeks ago, was that I think instead of doing that, there should be four hosts, one for each day. A Monday host, Tuesday host, Wednesday host, and Thursday host. Which of the ideas do you like?
Here's what I'll say. And again, I'm new. I only worked there for like four-ish months btefore the strike happened so as I said, I am the youngest writer there so my idea counts for nothing but I think a new host a week is unsustainable, not in terms of what we do. I honestly think we could do it and it felt like people were very excited. New hosts coming in every week it just like you know, some people have been there for 10 years. So like it's fun to have someone new to write for. But I can't think of 40 people a year who I would want to see do The Daily Show. It's not SNL where it's like, oh, it's really fun to watch Tom Brady try to act. I don't want to see Tom Brady sit behind a desk and read a prompter. So I think yes, I think maybe a group of hosts. I think your idea is great. I know there were a lot of ideas that were kicking around. We had just announced actually, right before the strike, the newest batch, one of those batches was groups of the correspondents. I think it would be cool. I think everyone seems to be really into it. I was literally at a bar last night and some my friend of mine who I didn't even think was really a fan of The Daily Show was like I love watching it with all the hosts, so I think it's cool, but who knows? Who knows? And personally for my own job security, if they never hire a permanent host, then there's never anyone who can come in and be like, you know what, I think I should bring in my own writing staff. Rotating is good for me.
You said that you knew this whole time that the strike was going to happen or on the horizon. So when when they announced the summer slate, or the May and June slate of hosts, and you show up May 1 with Dulce Sloan for day one of her week. Did Dulce or (Michael) Kosta or like the other people down the line. Do they all have this sense? Of like, well, this is not happening or?
I think everyone knew. I was talking to Kosta like weeks before that because we had worked on some piece. And he was like damn, I can't believe my week is scheduled right in the middle of the writers strike. I think people knew I mean maybe people were hopeful that it wouldn't come to this but I think the vibe was very much like may 1 last day of work.
What was that last day like with Dulce being her first night of her week?
Actually I hate to say, I was working remotely. We get one remote day a week. And I was like, I wanted to go in because I knew it was going to be the last day but I had gotten in really late from Cabo that week. So I don't know exactly what the vibe was like, but I see them all the time because we're picketing and we have our own little WhatsApp group and we coordinate.
I know you can't speak for the show, but it's got to throw a whole wrench into their plan of being able to announce a new host for September.
Yeah, I obviously have no idea. I don't even think our higher ups necessarily know if we're going to come back and have a new host or if we're going to come back and pick up where we left off. I would love to pick up where we left. I was like really excited about the people that they announced. And we hadn't even gone through all of our like Ronny (Chieng) and Kosta and you know, not everyone had gotten a week so it was like we should at least do that. But you know, I'm not in charge.
Part of the reason we had scheduled this before the strike was that you already have this other plan for the summer. Which is your one-woman musical, the Shiva to end all Shivas, Sophie Sucks Face. How long have you been working on this? Not to try to tie down the date and the place or the names…
I've been working on it for about a year and a half. I wrote it last January and then first performed it last March.
How has it changed in the last year?
It's been mostly little tweaks here and there. Just like punching up jokes, adding a song, changing some choreography, changing my costume, just anything to make it sort of a little sharper, a little funnier. Doing it one last time in New York before I go to the Edinburgh Fringe Festival in August. And that will be the first time that I've shaved it down significantly. So it runs about an hour 15, I'm trying to get it closer to an hour. So that will be like some bigger changes but honestly, I spent so long thinking about it, outlining it sort of just like sitting in like the thoughts and the themes and the staff and music and musical silence that I wanted to write and when I finally like, you know, pounded it out in January. It was pretty close to what I wanted it to be.
It's one thing to do it at your home base at BCC, where you know everybody and all your friends can show up, cheer you. It's another thing to take it to Edinburgh, Scotland and do it night after night for three and a half weeks. Who have you talked to what have you done? I know there’s still a couple of months to prepare. But what have you done to other than trying to shave 15 minutes or what have you done to prepare yourself mentally and professionally for this adventure?
Yeah, professionally. I have two wonderful producers who helped me put it on here in New York and LA occasionally. Zach Schiffman and Rachel Moss and we sort of at the beginning of this year in the fall which was already I guess, compared to some other people's schedules sort of late to be diving into the Edinburgh prep phase, but we just met a lot of people who had done it before and ask them what they what they did and people whose shows were successful. I talked to Sam Blumenfeld, who directed Emily Wilson’s show, we talked to Gabe Mollica, who's having like a great run at SoHo Playhouse and a couple of other people. So we learned sort of just like the nuts and bolts of like, what sort of venues you apply to, where you want to be who you want on your team, you know, do you want a publicist? Do you want a UK-based producer do you want to call out all this stuff? Here's what you should spend money on, here's what you shouldn't. But then in terms of like, personal preparation, you know, my I work with a vocal coach, that I think is going to be the hardest part about doing it 25 nights is my voice. She told me that I should start building some physical stamina just in general, not even vocally. Because I dance or whatever. I'm just expecting it to be sort of an insane push. My little sister's coming with me to help run tech. That I think will be nice to have like someone and Zach and Rachel are going to be there. Then I do have a UK producer who will be there. So I feel like I have like a good support system in place. But yeah, I really don't know what it's going to feel like and I'm not expecting it to be easy at all.
Have you have you allowed yourself to look into the future, even past the Fringe to see, like, what this show might become?
Yeah, I have really big dreams for it. Because it’s my favorite thing that I've made so far. I used to say I would love to get an Off Broadway run, you know somewhere maybe back to SoHo Playhouse maybe Cherry Lane if we have like the kinds of investors and producers and staff. I used to say Off Broadway, now I'm like Alex Edelman’s shows on Broadway so I'm like, OK hey, fuck it, I can I'll eight shows a week on Broadway, then I'll really be like proving my high school self wrong. Well, beggars can't be choosers. And then I really want to make it a movie musical. Part of the reason why I did it out in LA was to sort of plant that idea in people's minds and some people were excited about it.
You did have Rachel Bloom on hand for your Dynasty Typewriter show.
Yes. And I've been talking to a couple people about that. Although again those conversations sort of halted because the writers strike but, you know, depending if we have good reviews at Fringe or we had a good audience, or maybe you know, we win an award or whatever, then I think that sets us up in a good position to be like, hey, this is the story that people like let's make a lot of stuff with it.
I saw the show as it's been developing at Brooklyn Comedy Collective, and I'm also interested to see how your show and other shows change in Edinburgh because it's just one of those things that happens especially when you do the show night after night.
I've performed it for obviously a very American coastal audience. I've only ever done it in New York and LA. I am working with a publicist over there. She is Jewish, she assured me there are plenty of Jews in Scotland, and I think the humor translates. I’m reading the Mike Nichols memoir, like a couple of years behind everybody else, but like it just struck me how Jewish like just everything used to be like just shows with like, not explicitly about anything Shiva, Shabbat just like, you're like, Oh, that's a Jewish family or that's a Jewish romantic lead or whatever. And so I'm sort of hoping that it transcends culturally.
I think they're still aware of Jewishness in show business.
But we'll see. We will see, yeah, definitely curious, not just strangers, but I have a couple of friends in Scotland that have lived there and I was thinking I'm gonna like schedule a call with them and be like, OK, do they know who this person is (over there)? Do they know who this person is? You know? If I say Bryan Singer like does that ring a bell? You know, like that, like?
I hear Kevin Spacey has an Airbnb.
Do you have a more Scottish example of a sort of popular sexual abuser?
Well, Sophie zucker, thank you so much for taking time out of picketing to be with me. I wish you and all of the writers more than luck. I wish you great success with the strikes and have fun in Scotland.